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On Sep 29, 2010, at 9:02 AM, Bob Gillis wrote:
see below answers
I have a couple of questions regarding the domes:
1. What material is the canvas made out of and what's the weight?
Shelter Systems' coverings are made by taking a special plastic copolymer (a simple compound composed of carbon and hydrogen which is chemically similar to wax) and stretching it until it becomes stiff. At this point, the material is at its maximum tensile (pull) strength. It is then sliced into thin strips and woven into a fabric. This gives it amazing tear resistance. The fabric is then laminated on both sides with some sheets of the same stretch-strengthened material and is thereby stabilized and super strengthened. You cannot tear it with your hands.
Approximately 4 oz for a square yard
2. I'm needing to have a rain catchment areas and was thinking of putting a tarp on top of the dome- raised in 4 corners and have 4 catchment areas in the creases. I read that it was not advisable to have anything over the domes- why is this the case?
Rain Catchment System: The flap of shingling material that circles the dome at about 5' can be tucked into a gutter that can direct rain run off into storage. The gutter could be of metal or fabric and should hang from the 12 clips that circle the dome just under the ring pole at the above mentioned 5'. In most towns there are individuals who are in the business of making custom gutters (look in the yellow pages). I would recommend a narrow gutter of say 2.5" to 3" as you will want to fit the gutter under the pole system of the dome. Each of the 12 gutter joints should be the same 150 degree angle. You will need a down spout and a storage tank for the water.
Another gutter system can be constructed using a long strip of water tight fabric such as a blue tarp material say 18" in width and long enough to go around the dome and then downward into a water storage vessel (this can also be made of a blue tarp by cutting a tarp into a circle with a radius of say 8'. Then gather circumference of the circle tarp around one of your vent tubes and tie it tight with some of the line included with your dome. Tie this upon tube to a clip of your dome at about 5' high so the tube is about a 12" off the ground. You will then need to start to attach your "gutter" to the 2" skirt of your dome at the approximate height of 5' and circle the dome so as to create a gutter of tarp material on both sides of this 2" skirt that starts at with a gutter that is only 3" deep and ends with the gutter being 9" deep once it is all the way around the dome. One way to attach the "gutter" is to use 3" by 1/8" by 1/8" sharpened slivers of wood as pins to pin the tarp cutter to this 2" skirt. The gutter then should be formed into a tube and directed down into your water storage "bag". A length of tubing can be also inserted into the bag thru the tube to syphon water as you need it. Be careful to prevent small rodents from gaining access to you water as they may drown and pollute your water. Filtering and water purifying systems may be relevant. If your needs are small a 55 gallon plastic drum may suffice. For filtering do a search online for ( rain water filter system ) One we found was: http://www.baproducts.com/rainwatr.htm
DO NOT COVER SHELTER WITH A TARP, PARACHUTE OR ANYTHING OTHER THAN A SINGLE LAYER OF OUR SUNSHADES. A tarp can fill with rain and collapse shelter. A tarp will trap heat and cause the poles to deform. Do not cover your dome with anything except a single layer of our SunShade. Do not overlap sunshades.
Cheers for you response!
On Jun 30, 2010, at 2:23 PM, Bob Gillis wrote:
Customers have painted our domes but I do not know how they worked over time for them. The domes covering is smooth and stiff paint could be stressed when the dome is folded up. Can spray paint may work. Permanent markers seem to be a sure bet. Test out to be sure what you use will work for you. You can attach canvas or other material by using Grip Clips to tie them to the clips on the inside or out side of the dome; this would let you remove the paintings when you fold up the dome. Let us know what works for you. Send a photo so we can show others.
Hi. This is Mood Me Content and we recently purchased one one of your Bubble domes( 10 ). We would like to know if it is possible to use a certain type of paint ( or something similar) on the the material that is used for bubble dome 10. This will help us a lot. It would be most appreciated if you can get back to us as soon as possible.
On Jun 29, 2010, at 10:28 AM, Dustin wrote:
Gotcha, I will look for another option then.
On Tue, Jun 29, 2010 at 8:20 AM, Bob Gillis <email@example.com> wrote:
Subject: crystal caves at burning man?
Hi Eleanor, we recently purchased an 18' playa dome for bm and quite
like it. I'm curious if you know of anybody taking the crystal caves
to the playa as well - are they durable enough? We wouldn't hole up in
there during a storm, but it would be nice if it was strong enough to
leave up outside.
On May 18, 2010, at 8:28 AM, Bob Gillis wrote:
I have been in touch with Eleanor about the purchase of a dome.
I teach Yoga Teacher Trainings using a camping format. I have a retreat center in Baja and when back in Canada my program is mobile. Since we do get rain and we are outdoors I am looking for something like your yurt /dome to hide in should the weather not be ideal for us.
Sounds like a good use. If you end up using one please send us a photo.
I do like to be with nature as much as possible and use grassy areas. If the weather was raining would I need to have the floor or would the water run under the sides and into the dome area?
Site selection is all important. It would depend on the lay of the land and the type of soil and how hard the rain. if the soil is porous and water soaks in you could be fine; if you are on a hill top water could flow away from your dome; in a flooding condition you need a floor. Being on a site slope with a ditch on the uphill side of the dome is often ideal. It would be prudent to bring a tarp to lay down if you found water flowing under the edge of your dome. If the ground is grassy or damp and you have a cool night you could well have condensation on the inside of the dome. Laying a tarp over the ground for the night can help with this. Having the doors open and sun will help also.
Regarding the colour. I see that you only have white. Since I am in nature and do like to blend into the environment with the products that I use - this colour is a challenge for me. Eleanor said that some people have painted the dome. If this is the case, what kind of paint can be used and how to apply it?
I believe they used spray cans of paint. Test first to make sure it works and stays to your expectations. You could also use a sunshade to help hide the white which will also keep the dome much cooler in the sun.
How long does the material usually last?
In Florida and Arizona it has lasted 3 + years. We guarantee it for 1.5 years (this is to cover very high elevations where there is considerable UV.
I saw in one of your photos that people used the dome for a party and had one side open. Is this possible or was this custom?
This is possible with all our domes. See the online manual. I does weaken the dome a bit in strong wind.
Thank you for your time and consideration
On Apr 30, 2010, at 12:23 PM, Bob Gillis wrote:
We make a "Crystal Cave" : http://www.shelter-systems.com/tunnle-shelters.html Which is the same design as the porch.
As to water running in an open door under the porch: the porch over hangs the door; with the door open the water running down the dome hits the gutter that is created by the open flap and is directed to the side of the door opening.
Thank you very much for getting back to me this morning Bob. :)
I've talked over ideals with my husband and we had another question. Tarp vestibules would likely work for three of the four doors as they would be more like windows than actual entry/exit points for us. Our quandary is with the front door. We have to go in and out of the tent a lot for cooking, drinking water, bathroom, etc and having a really low vestibule would be very physically tiring with having to duck so much - especially when carrying things in and out with us.
I again looked over the porch you sell. My question is - can this be specially made in a larger size? Also, does rain water end up between the tent and the porch, making things wet in front of the door?
No worries on rain or snow building up and collapsing anything. After eight years in our current tent we are pretty much pro at dealing with such things. Our current tarp/tent system can not hold much snow at all (about a inch, depends on snow wetness) and we are adept at making sure things drain well with rain. Two years ago we had about 4 feet of snow in two days - that was an adventure I hope to not do again too soon. :)
Thanks again for your time, I really appreciate it. I'm starting to get kind of excited about getting into one of your tents soon - it will be a fair bit larger than our current one and I'm pretty tired of the dingy brown and blue coloring. lol
Have a great day! Lisa
On Apr 28, 2010, at 7:40 AM, Bob Gillis wrote:
I just received some samples from you and had a couple of questions.
I live up in Olympia, Washington - lots of rain and some snow each winter. My husband and I are under a large maple/alder canopy and our current tent is dying after many years. We have been doing tent life for the last eight years due to a lot of chemical sensitivities making it nearly impossible for us to be indoors someplace affordable yet. Looking at possibly replacing our tent this summer and I ran across your product.
Under a tree canopy all year, the only real sun we see here is early spring and very late fall - maybe a few hours a day directly on our site. Approximately how long could we expect the exterior yurt fabric to last?
I would think you could expect a very long life. My family lived in a dome for 9 years in what sounds like a similar shady location in Santa Cruz CA: http://www.goodtimessantacruz.com/santa-cruz-news/good-times-cover-stories/986-from-here-to-haiti.html
I saw that bamboo poles can be used in place of the pvc pipe, are there other options too that will work or is it pretty much only bamboo and pvc?
You could use flexible branches. But by far the easiest is pvc as other poles are not of consistent diameter or stiffness.
I've read that you suggest not to use tarps over the top of the yurts, is this only because of the trapped heat or is there some other reason preventing this? Its very, very handy here to have some tarps coming out around the tent windows/doors as we tend to leave them open year round and rain/snow blow would be a problem without them. I've seen your small porches you sell, these don't look like they'd work for our kind of weather - due to wind there really needs to be about four feet of shelter in front and to both sides of each window/door at a minimum and it looked like yours don't really cover the sides very far.
It would be fine to have tarp vestibules over doors. Just do not drape tarps over the dome as they can if in direct sun soften and deform your poles. Tarps can also collect water and collapse the dome.
Be sure to read our snow and wind warnings.
I think this covers my initial questions. :)
Thank you very much for your time and I am looking forwards to your reply,
On Apr 13, 2010, at 10:21 AM, Bob Gillis wrote:
The answer is shade cloth. We offer sunshades http://www.shelter-systems.com/accessories.html . Open the domes 4 doors and use a sunshade and you will be impressed how comfortable the domes can be. The external poles of the dome keep the shade cloth away from the covering so that the suns heat that they block is carried away by the air between the two and is not conducted to the inside of your dome. It is true however that you cannot expect the inside air temperature of the dome to be less then the outside air temperature, but sitting in the shade with 4 doors makes a huge difference. Most tents the temperature can build and build as there is not effective shade and the heat cannot except.
The shade should also help to make your computer more visible.
On Mar 17, 2010, at 9:24 AM, Bob Gillis wrote:
Our domes are very strong, drum tight and well supported that shed the wind well. We believe that they are the strongest structure for the materials used. We strive to make a sturdy portable shelter at an affordable price that will out preform all tents but those made of much heavier or very expensive materials.
We do not rate our domes for wind of a certain mph but they have withstood storms that I was told gusted at 60 mph ( http://www.shelter-systems.com/burning-man-wind.html ). This wind storm that lasted about 2 hours. Persistent wind at a much lower level will eventually cause components to wear and fail.
If a well anchored dome fails from extreme wind what usually happens is that a small number of poles fail and the cover collapses. After the storm passes the broken pvc poles can be easily repaired or replaced and the dome put up again. http://www.shelter-systems.com/lighthouse-manual.html
Our PlayaDomes is no different that our standard "extra strong" domes.
On Mar 17, 2010, at 8:12 AM, Bob Gillis wrote:
Here is the manual link: http://www.shelter-systems.com/lighthouse-manual.html and http://www.shelter-systems.com/lighthouse-30-31-addition.html
There is in the manual info on wood stove installation and dome repair, You should have got bag with some extra cord and parts with your dome if you need to replace any.
Your dome even with a hole near the top will not draw out enough smoke to make an open fire workable. You could possibly run a stove pipe up near the center of the dome by installing a sheet of thin ply wood. You would need to use insulated pipe and proper stove pipe fittings where you pass through the plywood. If you do this our dome would most likely leak water if it rains.
We have a 30' dome, which we've been using at Burning Man for several years. I personally wasn't involved with assembling/disassembling it in the past; however, I will need to be doing it this year. Hence, these questions:
- I was told that when our dome was being disassembled last year, some strings that hold connectors were torn. I'm not sure I'm using the right terminology here, but is there anything that can be done to repair that?
- Is the manual on your website the same as the one that came with the dome originaly? If that's not the case, would you be able to send me a copy of the one you typically put into the packages you send out?
- Is it possible to put a fire pit/fireplace inside the dome on a fireproof mat? Can enough ventilation be provided without a pipe (i.e. by maybe opening the top two or three sections during the time the fire is burning)? If a pipe is a must, can it go to the very top instead of getting out of the dome somewhere on a side as suggested in the "Installing a wood stove" section on your website?
Many thanks in advance,
On Mar 4, 2010, at 10:11 AM, Bob Gillis wrote:
Your dome poles will take a slight bend over time and this does not effect the function of the dome. You should never cover your dome with a tarp as this can trap heat and melt your poles or collect water and collapse your dome. If you find any are severely bent then you can replace them with 1" class 200 PVC which you should be able to get from an irrigation supply store. We also sell poles: http://www.shelter-systems.com/accessories.html
Subject: PVC question
First I have to tell you that I was living like a king at my first burn last year. The 18' dome is massive when your inside it and a great shelter in the wind!
It's been up and down 4 time since and quite a bit of the PVC is getting a bit warped. What do you recommend as far as replacing pieces. Nothing is cracked or broken, I just want to be proactive and make sure my home away from home stays in great shape.
On Feb 26, 2010, at 11:25 AM, Bob Gillis wrote:
At each point where poles cross there is a clip on the inside of the dome. This clip has holes in it that dividers can be attached to.
You can use any type of heater you choose.
Read our online manual for both of these: http://www.shelter-systems.com/lighthouse-manual.html
On Dec 12, 2009, at 10:03 AM, Bob Gillis wrote:
I am considering the 25 ft cover top for my koi pond. I have a few questions:
- i see the warranty but how many years can the cover top model realistically last if i have it up for 5 months a year only in winter?
my guess would be 6 - 12 years. It is the sun that will eventually wear out the cover; but it will not hold snow; if it collapses in your pond from snow build up; it would be a major hassle but most likely the damage to the dome would amount mostly to the inexpensive PVC pipes and a few panels; panel repair and or replacement is detailed in the online manual and though doable it is best to be avoided by keeping the snow off the cover
panels can be replaced individually; say if it was damaged; but if your cover is worn out it is best to replace the whole thing
-Had one more question in addition to the below. I didn't see a liner made for the cover top models but would a liner help with frame hold up under snow?
No, it would not help.
Date: Tuesday, December 8, 2009, 7:23 PM
thoughts on the use of plastic
I thought I should share a few more thoughts about our use of plastic with you. Our culture uses plastic and being part of the culture we can not avoid it. I do feel it is important to limit its use were possible. This is not easy since it is everywhere: we line our cars and paint our houses with it. For good reason: it has many virtues: strong, light , flexible and water and rot resistant. Most of the domes we make are used for basic shelter and I think we can feel good about this use. If our customer was to say build buy or rent a small wooden shelter I believe the harm to our earth would be greater. Think of all the plastics and other materials used. The shingles are petroleum based, the paint is plastics, the solvents are petroleum based, carpets are plastic, etc. There is also the use of other materials such as wood, etc. Another way is to examining the weight of the shelter and all the materials used. Take this small house I live in, it hugely massive and in constant decay, termites, sun, water and wear and tear. To live in one of our domes my footprint would be much smaller. The waste produced in building one of our 20' domes will fit in 1/2 of a shopping bag. They have been known to last 9 plus years in part shade. When they do finely brake down from the sun they sequestering their carbon in a landfill which is unlike the carbon of gasoline which ends up contributing to global warming.
Just bought a 10 foot extra strong dome for personal sleeping quarters at BM. I've already got an 18' dome that works well as communal shelter, but I'm tired of having my cheap sleeping tent blown to pieces.
The GroDome cover is not FR. Our Shelters Domes are FR however and we make the same size dome. The dome will handle some wind but not extreme wind. See our wind warnings: http://www.shelter-systems.com/warning.html
I like your photos and hope it works out for you
On Oct 29, 2009
Sent: Thursday, October 29, 2009 4:23 PM
Subject: questions about GroDome
The 31 has an extra ring of panals that add anadditonal 5' of hight; 40 more poles; and a large increase in volume. There is no difference in the materials used. Guylines if any can be added to the 20 clip clip cords at the 5' high ring that circles the dome (see the online manual for info on guying; http://www.shelter-systems.com/lighthouse-manual.html also see the wind and snow warnings: http://www.shelter-systems.com/warning.html
On Nov 1, 2009
Dear Shelter Systems,
All that you suggest have been done. To grow vines it is best to attach strips of bird netting to the pole structure with zip ties. Vines cling better to the net than the slippery poles. Lighting is better on the outside of the poles. The idea of plastic is better accepted when you realize that most paints, rugs are plastic.
On Oct 28, 2009,
hi, I plan to make the 14 or 18 ft arch dome into a partially open-air bedroom. I'm not that keen to live in plastic. Have there been any creative sucessful ideas to beautiful the structure...such as growing vines on the outside tubes, or lightweight bamboo matting on the interior? How about led xmas lights running along the tubes inside adn out? Please let me know if you know...thanks. Fin Jeff Wayman
Thanks for your interest.
Our Yurt Domes can be made quite comfortable in hot and cold climates. To keep cool our domes have 4 doors and upper vent systems and can be out fitted with external sun shades that are space above the domes covering for a breezy shaded space. To keep warm we offer as an accessory a full liner that creates a dead air insolation space of 2 to 3 inches. Since our shelters are dome shape they are the ideal shape for holding in warmth. Most find it is easy to keep warm in our domes even with out the liner. You can install a vented heater or wood stove, see: http://www.shelter-systems.com/lighthouse-manual.html Feel free to call if you want more details.
On Oct 23, 2009
I had some questions about your dome tents that I didn't see answered on your site.
What's the temp rating for these tents? I'm very interested in a yurt, too, specifically from Pacific Yurts and they are advertised as being warm in the winter and cool in the summer. I don't see any real ventilation in your tents nor a way to heat it without gassing myself. I'm looking at the dome as a semi-permanent home in Southern California.
No metal except 8 "s"hooks at ground level to hold 4 doors closed. You can if you want untie and remove the hooks and then tie the doors closed.
Hello Mr. Gillis,
Thanks for for your feedback about our domes.
The domes we make are a compromise of many factors. We try to create the right mix to produce a dome that functions reasonably well under most conditions and is still affordable and portable. Doors on tents present a tricky problem. Zippers do not work on large tents that have a lot of use. They are a hassle to use and tend to brake and jam. Velcro works but must be installed with the dome up, at times catches on clothing and hair, does not hold up to a lot of storage and may eventually need to be replaced. Large hooks or buckles do not effectively close the gape between the door flap and the dome's side walls. If the dome is not buffed by constant wind the another solution we have found is to install a door pole and secure one side of the door with the hook and let the weight of the pole close the door. This approach is spelled out in the online manual: http://www.shelter-systems.com/lighthouse-manual.html
We chose the maximum outside dimensions to represent our domes as they are big and fitting them into a site is often a problem of size. The liner is sized to produce an insulating layer of air from 2 to 3" will reduce the inside diameter by an additional 6". To achieve a shingled liner it must shingle from bottom to top. Having a complete liner means the door are doubled.
On Oct 16, 2009
Dear Eleanor & Bob:
I placed an order for an 18 ft dome on Aug 24, 2009, order number 2732. - I received the dome and other items ordered with one exception:
I notice that now on your website you sell strips of velcro also - 8 yards for $25. Really I wanted strips to begins with, but I only saw coins offered when I ordered. I don't know if that was my oversight, or if the strips are new to your site. Anyway, I really need velcro for the doors especially. I love the dome, but am quite dissatisfied with the way the doors close and supposedly seal or at least fasten with those little s hooks.
Also, along with my 18 foot dome (which really has inner dimensions of about 16 1/2 feet) I ordered a liner. The under and over design of the cover does not match well with the under/over design of the panels of the liner. This is a problem when it comes to the doors - it is awkward, and the overlaps are opposite of what they should be. Also, it would really be helpful to customers to include the INNER DIMENSIONS for your domes because both domes I have ordered from you are quite a bit smaller than I was expecting.
I think velcro strips will solve the problem, but I don't understand why your company doesn't just sell the dome in a form that works well on it's own, or why you don't just include a thorough amount of velcro stripping to fix the problem. I really don't understand how you think a person can securly close the doors from the inside using your system with tiny s hooks. It does not make sense. I willl use velcdro strips to try to remedy this, buy I am giving you this feedback on your product.
I called and did not get a person on the phone, so I am going to order online the velcro stripping I need as it's own order.
I am requesting that you either mail me the velcro coins included in the order from August, outlined below, or refund or credit me for the amount of the velcro coins I did not receive. I know I ordered around burning man time and you guys were really busy at that time. Thank you for your attention, and despite these door, sealing & liner issues I really love my dome.
Sorry for the delay. I am attaching only a few photos to keep the email size
The snow happened later and did no further damage. A couple gentle taps from
There were five grip clips that failed, one already broken upon arrival and
Many of the cords failed. I used plastic cable ties to secure some of the
I have concerns regarding the dome material itself. There seems to be
One of the photos show the buried shipping containers with southern exposure.
On Mon, 5 Oct 2009 05:30:38 -0700, Eleanor Hamner wrote
Thank you for your detailed email. I am going to forward it to the
Unfortunately we cannot send replacement panels by USPS because our
The material is rip-stop meaning that it should not continue to tear
Your GripClips were mailed by USPS about a week and a half ago. They
For shipping price quotes for additional parts (cord, etc), please
On Oct 2, 2009,
The dome was raised a week ago, just before 70km/h winds started. I
Later that week during my absence we had an uncommonly severe
With absolutely no trace of sarcasm, this is a great product. The
My heavy duty gripclips have not arrived yet. If they are not
One more question: if I decide to replace the damaged panels later
PS - Let me know if you want some pictures of the damage for your
On Fri, 18 Sep 2009 11:30:14 -0700, Eleanor Hamner wrote
Thank you for your feedback about UPS. I too wish we could use the
It looks like I made a mistake and did not tell the warehouse to
We have a 10' dome and a 14' dome. Look at: http://www.shelter-systems.com/sizes.html to figure out what might be the right size for you.
It is critical that you insulate the dome in a way that does not cause the poles to heat up as they will bend out of shape. DO NOT COVER the poles with a tarp or blankets. You can insulate with a liner which you could make of blankets etc. We make a liner for the domes and you could stuff straw between the liner and the outer cover.
Date: October 8, 2009 8:09:21 AM PDT
I am looking for a dome that will enable me to teachsweat lodges as i travel a lot i would want somehing that was portable and coudl hold 15 people sitting up ,,
Date: October 1, 2009 11:39:22 AM PDT
I first read about your products and Robert Gillis in Design Like you Give a Damn. Great Book, very inspiring.
Customer Service questions -
Menlo Park CA
Where is product manufactured?
Santa Cruz CA; we also ship from here.
How long does it take from order time to delivery to my door?
For a special order which the BD 14 is it would take about 2 to three weeks, call the order desk for more detailed ship time. Special Orders are not returnable. The BDs other than the 10 are hard to use the height and are more subject to wind. Why not the standard 18' dome.
Product questions -
1. I wish you had more photos in your online manual. Drawings are sometimes hard to read, especially the numeric dimensions. Is a hardcopy included with purchase?
We include a printed manual with our domes but there is more and more current info in the online manual.
2. Will material burn if it comes into contact with a fire or sparks or a hot stove or will it just melt?
Our Shelter Covering is FR. It will melt and burn if you supply a flame to it but will go out once the flame is removed.
It will be under deciduous trees. So damp, cold and rainy for 6 months.
In Portland under tree shade about 6 years or more.
The white is lovely, but I fear discoloration from moss/mildew. I don't see that other colors are available. I am assuming it is one big piece of material.
We only use white; it will not mildew but dirt on it can if you do not keep your dome dry inside. It can be cleaned with soap and water.
4. If there are no color options, Can the material be painted (with some kind of fabric dye/paint)? Do you know of anyone who has done that or who has made it a more colorful dome? I see pictures of a deep blue and brown on your testimonial pages. How is that done?
I have known people to use can spray paint on the dome. Test first.
5. I see it says no tarps or other material over the dome in the Q and A. Is the warranty voided if they are used?
Tarps can collect material and or rain and collapse the dome. Do so at your one risk. If you created a peaked tarp cover it should shade the rain to the ground and not collect rain or debris.
6. Is the fabric detachable from the frame?
Is it washable?
It is best washed while set up.
7. Can it be put up by one person?
Yes, but strongly recommend two able people at least the first time.
I wish you had a video/dvd showing setup.
8. Once up, can things be hung from walls or roof; from the lightweight - laundry, to heavier items - a wood backed mirror? It looks like the structural elements are on the outside only.
How "hang" liners, net doors, dividers, floors and decorate inside your dome?
9. I see that liners, floors and porches are available. Are windows available for bubble or do I have to make them?
Windows are not standard in the bubble domes. We can put in small trangulare windows at the trangular panles for $35 each. but on the BD they are too high to see out of.
The website is great. There is a lot of info there, so I may have asked questions that are answered.
Date: October 5, 2009 2:36:20 PM PDT
Subject: shingle leak problem
Shingling problems has happened in the past and the most common reason is that the outer shingle is twisted; if this happens the outer most shingle does not cover the inner layers and water can run into them and thereby into the dome.. First suggest to the customer that sometimes the poles are causing the clip to twist and deform the shingling, which can be solved by removing the poles from the dysfunctional clipped shingling; straightening out the twisted clip and connectors and then re-inserting the poles.
This twisted shingling can also happen when the dome was clipped up at the shop, but this is rare. It might also be possible that the overlap has been cut too short to protect the inner layers from the weather, but this is also uncommon These two problems can be fixed by unclipping re-arrange the layering and then re-clipping (only an ambitious customer can sometimes fix this themselves. (the easiest way for a customer to do this is:
Remove only one clip from your dome being careful not to disrupt the layering sequence of the panels on your dome. If you can not get the clip off use a pliers and brake the ring part of the clip use the spare Heavy Duty Grip Clip that comes with your dome to replace this clip. 3) Take your time to make sure all layers are flat and in the same layering sequence and orientation (look at and marks on the corners of the layers you are to re-clip and make sure they aline. 4) Now with all layers in the same order and orientation as before; gather these tightly around the male clip and slip over the female clip as described in the manual. When many layers are involved as is the case with the corners of the windows, attaching the female clip can be difficult; practicing on scraps before you do this on your dome. Making the layers warm with the sun or heat lamp (be careful not to melt the covering by getting it to hot) can help.
Hi eleanor this is Johnny. We spoke on the phone about the hole in the floor. Also by saturday or sunday I should have the dome set up so I can take pictures of the specific overlap I was talking about. We took pictures when we first got it (lisa was dismayed at how dirty it was but I told her it was used and thats why it was 10% off) but didnt know enough about it to focus on any one area. I'll take a ruler and try to get detailed shots of it.
Date: October 1, 2009
Subject: Re: Dinner tents
This is best determined by you. Draw a circle using a 10' cord and some caulk or small stones by having a friend hold one end of the cord to the ground and you walk around with the other end marking the ground. Then set some chairs etc in side to see how big it is. Also see: http://www.shelter-systems.com/sizes.html
Great option, and the price for 20feet??
Date: September 29, 2009 11:12:37 AM PDT
Subject: Re: emergency preparedness dome
The floor which is not included in the price of the basic dome (see: http://www.shelter-systems.com/accessories.html ) includes clips to attach it to the wall of the dome in 12 places. The floor is removable for cleaning and replacement. It goes up against the side-walls on the inside of the dome. It can be taped or glued to the wall of the dome: ( http://www.shelter-systems.com/lighthouse-manual.html ) but this is not usually necessary and does not effect the water tightness of the dome.
Yes, you or least I would be comfortable up to the 20' dome. Not knowing how big a stove you have I am not sure about the 30 or 31. Read our snow and wind warnings.
Subject: Re: storage for 20' yurt
thanks very much- worked well.
On Tue, Sep 8, 2009
Storage: Brush off all the dirt that you can. Make sure the dome is completely dry. If you have to take the dome down wet, plan to hang it indoors from the top clip until it's dry before packing. Remove stakes, vent tubes and poles. The liner may stay attached. We've found the following folding technique to be the easiest. Lay the dome on its own floor. Put one stake in the ground, to use as an anchor during folding. Hook the clip string at the very top center of the dome to the stake. Pull all the dome's edges so that it fans out and lies flat, one half on top of the other half. Then pleat-fold it so that the canopy forms a narrow triangle 4' wide at the base. Try to get each fold as flat as possible. Slip the tip of the triangle off the stake now and begin rolling it tightly down toward the wide end until you've got a nice bundle. Clean and dry both sides of the floor. After the floor is dry, fold it into a 4' wide strip. Lay the tent roll and other small parts at one end and roll the whole thing up tightly. Wrap your dome in the material you received it in and use strings to hold the roll tight.
Now tie the poles into a bundle. To get it nice and tight, wrap string twice around the bundle of poles and use a packer's knot. This is a kind of slip knot that holds tight.
You can use a house vacuum to compress your packed dome to about 1/2 its volume; roll and pack up your dome as above; warp in its wrapper it came with; tape the long seam of the wrapper; tape any holes in the wrapper. twist one end tight and then fold and tape this twisted end to the package; insert your vacuum hose in the other end twist and tape it tight; turn on your vacuum; with the vacuum on push on the package and it will compress to about 1/2 its original size; now tape around and around your package with the vacuum still on (this is to hold the package compressed when you remove the vacuum. now remove the vacuum and tape the end of your package closed.
On Sep 8, 2009
We own one of your 20' yurts and have been delighted with it so far. It arrived nicely folded but we have had trouble finding a way returning it to a compact form. Is there an easy way to roll, fold, stuff, or otherwise miniaturize it for storage? If so, is there an appropriate stuff-stack size?
Thanks for your help-
Subject: Re: tape and such
I forget, how old is your dome; does it have fabric side walls or is it all white woven plastic? It sounds like you have looked through the online manual: http://www.shelter-systems.com/lighthouse-manual.html We have been testing the tape for about 4 months but not long enough to tell if it leaves a sticky residue. Clear Silicon Rubber 100% in caulking gun size is an affordable alternative. It takes about 24 hr to cure. I know what you mean about the residue from the Velcro. You might get it off with Goo be Gone which is a citrus based solvent. The white dome cover is not effected by any solvent I have tried. If you have a solvent in mine test it first on the edge of the domes skirt; but my guess is that you would have no problem. Bent poles will not effect the strength of your dome but if you want to replace any or all you can get class 200 PVC at most irrigation supply stores: for example: Ewing Irrigation in SC or Scott Valley Sprinkler. Take an average measurement from 10 of your poles for measurement and a hack saw so you can cut your poles there to fit in your car.
On Sep 10, 2009, at 8:05 AM, cynthia wrote:
Anyway my question is-
Also- most of my poles are permanently bent now. Do you recommend replacing them? Is there a place in Santa Cruz that has the material?
I plan to be at the shop this sunday and will take measurements off the master dome so I can give you the length to cut your door poles. You can determine the length at your location if you want by the following: They should be a length so that they tension the bottom edge of the door. The way to measure the length is to slip the door pole onto one of the door plugs and hold it next to the other door plug such that the bottom edge of the door is tensioned. Mark the pole where it should be cut. They are easy to cut with a hack saw. After you cut your door poles mark them so they will not get mixed up with your other poles. You will need to bend the door poles to get them on the plugs. We no longer install screens when we make our domes. They are clipped so the user can install them by tying them to the two clips inside at the top of your doors. Velcro is not needed unless you are in a windy or high bug conditions but under these conditions it can be handy. The hooks at the bottom of your doors can be adjusted by removing and re-positioning the clips; note that this can effect the door pole length and is therefore best done before adjusting the pole length. Many tents use zippers but we have found that on any door with high traffic they fail. The domes we make are a compromise of many factors in an attempt to solve the problems associated with providing reasonable shelter at an affordable price. In non-extreme conditions they should perform admirably.
Dear Bob - thanks for your reply. I am still confused. The extra 4 poles are the long size - way too long for the bottom of the doors. Also, when I hook the doors closed without the bottom pole the wind (not strong wind at all - just gentle wind) blows it loose - there is air flow through, far from being sealed. It makes me think I need to add more fabric to extend the doors - but really I don't think this should be neccessary. The door are like weak flaps. Also I ordered a screen door but it did not come installed in the dome as the website said it would. So what is wrong? Again I would like to know what exact length to cut the extra pvc poles so that they will be EXACTLY right for the doors.
The standard length poles should fit the door plugs for some reason the spacing between the plugs on your 14' dome is off. You should not find this problem in our other domes.
A door pole is mostly used just on the one door that is used to enter and exit the dome; the other doors being hooked closed. If you find that the pole is to long for the plugs to fit then remove one or both plugs from the door clips by untying the clip cord, re-attach the cord with the hook back to the clip and then tie the plug back to the clip cord with a seperate length of cord (from your domes parts bag) this will lengthen the distance from the plug to the clip so that you can now insert the door plugs into the pole with out cutting the pole.
On Aug 17, 2009
Yes; I think we talked on the phone? Thickness and stiffness of what your are gripping is critical so you may depending on the thickness of your shade cloth need to double or triple it to get the right grip. You can do this by rolling the button part of the clip with your cloth before clipping or cutting small patches which you then layer and clip.
On Aug 4, 2009
We have a 14' Shelter Systems dome that we take out to Burning Man. We
Question, though.... would the black sunshade closest to the dome,
Subject: Re: Black sunshade + Aluminet (question!)
You do not want to layer two sunshades on top of each other. The reason for this is that air flow is greatly restricted which blocks the cooling effect of the air moving through the shade. This can cause your poles to deform and your dome to over heat. Best you is to cover your dome with one layer of sunshade and to open all doors and vents. Do Not Cover Your Dome With Tarps or Multiple Layers of Sunshades.
On Jul 29, 2009
The 30 and 31 will hold a small amount of snow but snow can be very heavy and must be knocked or melted off as it accumulates. A wood stove or heater can be used to melt the snow off. The 30 is stronger in wind since it sticks up less. They both do well in moderate wind but we do not recommend them for extreme wind. See our wind and snow warnings: http://www.shelter-systems.com/warning.html See the online manual for packing and anchoring instructions: http://www.shelter-systems.com/lighthouse-manual.html We have a 10% discount if you get 10. We try hard to keep our pricing down for everybody. You should have your domes in about a week to 10 days. Contact: Orders & Customer Service 866-777-1066 firstname.lastname@example.org for accurate timing. Branding is best done by printing on vinyl banners and then tying to the clips on the dome; Kinkos can print out banners for you.
On Jul 25, 2009
I live in northern New Jersey and I'm considering your product to extend the season of my swimming pool. What are the insulating properties of your cover? How many BTU's will I need to add at various outside tempteratures assuming I buy the 31 diameter dome?
Subject: Re: Portable Watsu and Swimming Pool cover
Our pool covers slow the cooling of pools by creating a barrier between the air over the pool and outside the dome. They also act as a solar heat collector during the day. I do not know how many BTUs you would need to add at various temperatures. This depends on a lot of factors including the volume of water the, the shape of your pool, the insolation between the water and the ground that surrounds your pool, circulation of the water etc.
Subject: Re: micro grip clip question
On Jul 24, 2009
Luckily for me, I noticed you are based in menlo park. Our wedding is
Lastly, I saw on your website that you only sell the smallest ones
Hi Helen and Luke
My guess is they would work but test them for your self to confirm that they work to your satisfaction before using them. If you find they slip because the scarfs are so shear then include a section of a balloon with the layers to provide additional friction.
On Jul 22, 2009
Here is a photo of a 14' and 10' domes packed up. You most likely would prefer the 14' as its voloum is 718 cubic feet and the 10' has a volume of 261 cubic feet.
On Jul 19, 2009
I'm definitely interested in a dome. If you were in your late 50's and
Subject: Re: Question about shelter systems
It sounds possible to me. I know of many who do. I have lived over 25 years and raised a family in these domes. One 20' dome in part shade lasted over 9 years and was then sold as a used dome. I do not know the laws in your area but if you can make friends with your neighbors then it could work out even if the laws are against you. Often it is OK to put up a tent but some areas frown on living in them. I would recommend a 20' since it has a lot space for the cost. Sounds like wind and snow are not a problem for you. You may want a friend to help you put it up the first time but one person can for sure do it. See: http://www.shelter-systems.com/lighthouse-manual.html I also suggest reading the Q & A sections: http://www.shelter-systems.com/qanda.html as there is a lot of practical info there. If you do not have shade then get a sunshade with your dome: http://www.shelter-systems.com/accessories.html Also look at: http://www.shelter-systems.com/yurt-dome-testimonials.html
If you do end up living in one of our domes keep us informed how it works for you and send photos.
On Jul 22, 2009, at 9:19 AM, Claudia López wrote:
Thank you very much for your response. We are waiting for our client to decide if they'll buy it or not. Do you think it's possible to fit 15 sitting people inside the 20' dome? Can you send me some pictures of this dome? On your testimonial, i just found pictures for the 30' and smaller domes. Thank you
Subject: Re: Information about the Domes
I have seen 49 people sitting on the ground inside a 20' dome when a couple were getting married. It was full but you should fit 15 easy.
here is a photo of our 20' dome
Subject: Re: Information about the Dome
On Jul 17, 2009
It is possible to install air conditioners and lighting in our domes. As to the air conditioner: I suggest you shingle in a thin sheet of plywood cut to be slightly bigger (so it fits tight in the opening) than your door opening by rolling up the door cover and inserting the plywood inside the dome on the top of the sheet and out side below (this will make the plywood rain shedding). Drill two holes in the top of the sheet so you can tie it to the inside clips of the dome. Cut a hole in the plywood to fit your air conditioner as instructed by the manufacture of the air conditioner. You can install lighting using an extension cord and common electrical installation procedures.
On May 31, 2009
Thank you for your interest in our shelters.
The 18 foot dome is two packages:
The 20 foot dome is two packages:
Please let me know if you have any additional questions.
Subject: Re: Size of a packed up dome
Are stakes included in this as well? How many, if yes?
If no, will the set of 12 Super Stakes, in your opinion be all the I need to secure the dome on the playa?
The stakes we provide seem to work on the playa but our Extra Strong and Super Stakes are more secure. See: http://www.shelter-systems.com/lighthouse-manual.html
Would you recommend rebar as well as stakes?
Rebar can be used but is not as good as our Super Stakes: See: http://www.shelter-systems.com/lighthouse-manual.html
If yes for rebar, could that be replaced with more Super Stakes instead?
For the Sun Shade that is included, is that the black shade?
I am looking to purchase an additional shade for the playa dome. I noticed that the black shade blocks 80% & the silver shade blocks 70%, but the silver shade is notably higher in cost. May I ask why and what the difference is?
The black is less expensive to make. I like the black best but if you plan to lay a shad on say a car or a RV the silver will work better. The reason is with the dome the shade is separate from the dome so that air can pass under and through it while if you just lay it on your car air can not cool it as much so the silver would be better for this use.
I have never secured a structure with guy lines when I have camped before, the stakes were always enough for the dirt and the placement of my tent.
Yes. Under most situations you need not guy your dome. Indeed if you do be sure to do it with bungee cords attached; see: http://www.shelter-systems.com/lighthouse-manual.html
Do the instructions detail how best to secure the domes using the guy lines?
In one picture on your site, it looked like there was a hammock hanging on the outside of the dome. Is the dome strong enough to hold up one side of a hammock with a person sitting in it?
No, would you please send me the URL to the page so I can look at what you are talking about.
For the floor that can be purchased, does it come as a circle or a square? Is it specially cut for the dome?
It is an approximate circle. The dome is 12 sided and the floor is meant to fit inside the dome up against the side walls a little bit. You can just as well use a blue tarp and cut it your self.
For the All-Weather Duct Tape that is mentioned on your site, it is recommended to seal up unused doors, for events like Burning Man for example, to help keep out dust. Does this duct tape leave a sticky film on the plastic or tarp after it is removed?
This tape appears to be much better than the standard duct tape. It is UV stabilized which should greatly extend its useful life. We are testing it in full sun but not enough time has passed to tell if it will leave a sticky film on the dome or floor. It can be very useful at Burning Man.
I live in northern Florida. If I place my order for an 18' dome, plus stakes, sun shade & the floor today or tomorrow, can you estimate for me when it would arrive? I would like to receive the package no later than July 9th, if possible, for another trip I am planning.
We try to keep all our domes in stock but you will still need to get inline with your order since they are shipped in the order received. I would order right away as it takes at least a week to get to you using our standard ground shipping.
Will I need to sign for the package? I work during the day, so I may need to have it delivered to my job so I can sign for it.
With the items I mentioned above, about how big of a package would it be upon delivery?
Approximately three super sized duffle bags.
If I had it delivered to my job, I would need to make sure the size of the delivered package would fit in my car.
My guess is you can fit it all in your car.
When it's time to leave the BRC desert, I will have to catch a plane home. Will the dust left on the outside & probably inside of the dome be okay for a few of days until I get home, decompress & then get to wash it off? (as long as there is no moisture?)
Yes, but do when you can, hose and scrub it off inside and out and let it dry before completely before storing.
Thank you so much for taking the time to answer my questions. I have been reading your website & oogling over all the pictures :o) I am very much looking forward to having a dome in our life. Thank you again for your time & I hope to hear from you soon.
On Jun 29, 2009
This may just be the thing I have been searching for as an alternative to ugly metal sheds. My question is, do you have directions on how to secure the 5' X 5' PorchShell to a plywood structure?
I also love the domes for a greenhouse, but those are self explanatory so no questions on those, just hoping shelter-systems is a one shop stop for my various needs.
thank you in advance,
Subject: Re: question about the PorchShell
The PorchShell's poles terminate at it's edges with Grip Clips that have a nylon cords attached to them. One way to secure the shell to a plywood structure would be to attach "eye bolts" near the edge of the structure. Then tie the Grip Clip cords to the eye bolts such that the short "skirts" on the edges of the PorchShell shingle over the plywood to create a rain shedding structure. You could also nail or screw strips of thin wood to the skirts: see BikeShed manual: http://www.shelter-systems.com/bikeshed-manual.html
On Jun 10, 2009, at 7:18 PM
I'm wondering what the track record is with the 31'er out on the playa. I've seen them out there and noted one as something I'd like to build or buy. Then I got one used this year and wonder about the 200psi irrigation pipe exoskeleton. A lot - most even - of the folks I know, including myself, have built structures out there, albeit less beautiful and drum tight than yours - and used schedule 40. Surely you've heard back from customers and maybe even experimented yourselves out there. Do they really hold up to winds with the 200psi?
I expect we have 200 or more domes on the playa each year
The 31'er too?
So far so good; But the 30 is stronger.
Do you sell playa packages with SCH4o?
Or the 200psi like the one I've got? Can I safely upgrade to SCH40?
Not worth the investment. Would be very hard to put up
Any experience with that? Is it worth it?
I do not think so. If you give it a try I would like to hear about how it works out for you.
I'm just curious what my best option is to make this thing stay up out there. I don't want to change to thicker walled pipe if the fabric won't tolerate the extra tension. Any idea how many guy lines I should use on it and where to best attatch them for wind conditions?
Most people do not set guy lines, But if you want to the 30 and 31 can use up to 20. See the online manual.
Thanks lots for any insight you might be willing to offer on how I might best have success with and longevity from my dome. I also noticed that you sell the 10' 18' and 30' as "one of our strongest" on your website. I have the 31'. is the geometry the same as the 30 from the top down?
I'm wondering if I might do well to simply leave the bottom row of pipe off and have a slightly shorter and smaller diameter dome if I don't really need the extra space.
I'm thinking I could either roll up the extra material around the edges inside or remove the bottom row of shingled material all together. Any thoughts you might have on that?
Both will work fine.
Thanks a ton for your help. Impressive design. I'm excited to try mine out this year. I'd love it if you could copy this email in a reply and then insert answers to the questions right where they are - seems the easiest way for both of us to keep track of what got answered and what I should try to find out on my own or from other shelter-systems dome owners.
Let me know what you hear.
There must be a club, right? joke . . . joke. I'm just trying to be as prepared as possible this time for a change and starting to think about camp infrastructure improvements and disaster preparedness / backup solutions. Thanks for your thoughts and have a stellar day.
On Jun 4, 2009
Hey Bob --
Apologies if you aren't the right person to talk to - if you could redirect me to the right person in that case, it would be great. I am a Program Manager working in Microsoft Research on the WorldWide Telescope project: http://www.worldwidetelescope.org/Home.aspx. One of our missions is outreach in the science and ed communities to help kids explore astronomy and physics, and to that end we are trying to think of ways to build small "portable" planetariums. We have built one out of cardboard/clips/fabric/2x4s as a test but are looking for something easier to assemble and found your dome tents and think that might be an alternative.
My odd question is;
Our goal is to create small planetarium "kits" that we could sponser/send to our intl subsidiarys and to various institutions that we sponsor and would do PR around.
I know the questions are a bit odd, but the project is fun. If you want to see a quick preview of WorldWide Telescope, check out this video:
Subject: Re: Interesed in your Yurt Dome for some research
As a special order this order is: 20% more in cost and non-returnable, we can make you a 14'er out of a white and black covering we have. It is a black out covering. It however is not fire retardant. Our domes are not half spheres but 1/2 of a nearly spherical polyhedron.
On Jun 1, 2009
Your idea of using a dowel is interesting and may work of the binder clips are strong enough. Let me know how it works out. I will test it here also.
At present we recomend a UV stable white Duct Tape and Velcro: http://www.shelter-systems.com/accessories.html
Sticky back Velcro "coins" or strips can be used to create a tighter seal between the door of your yurt, dome and the wall or net door and wall or to hold the shingling of your dome tight. For doors make sure the door and wall are clean and dry before applying the Velcro. One way to attach "coins" of Velcro to your doors is to have a helper inside your dome. Secure the door closed with the bottom clip hooks. Cut the coin's backing so as to separate the coins each with their own backing. Then join the coins together hook to loop keeping their backings attached. With you on the outside and your helper on the inside, and taking care that loop part of the velcro is on your side remove the backing on the loop place it between the door cover and the side wall of your dome and stick it to the door cover. Then remove the backing to the hook side and stick it to the domes wall. Have your helper push from the inside with your hand on the outside to secure a good bond of the velcro to the door and wall. Continue to add more coins. Additional coins or strips of sticky back velcro can by purchased locally or from our Accessory page: http://www.shelter-systems.com/accessories.html
If you are using strips mark with a marking pen where the edges of the door cover or netting contacts the sides of the tent. Lift up the door and get it out of your way. Now measure and cut a length of "hook" Velcro long enough to secure one of the door's edges. You do not need to cover the whole length of the door as this may make it difficult to open or close the door. Remove the protective strip from the sticky back and apply this Velcro to the inside of the mark you have made on the side of the dome. Repeat for other side. Take two lengths of "loop" Velcro and Velcro them to the "hook" Velcro that you have already attached to the sides of your tent. Remove the protective strips from these. Now carefully lower and hook your door to the base of the dome. Press the netting or door to the exposed sticky of the Velcro. Rub well to secure the bonding of the glue to the door and the sides of your Yurt Dome. Try not to stress the Velcro glue bond till it is set as it can take up to 25 hours to reach its maximum holding power. Be sure to attach the "hook" part of the Velcro to the wall of the dome, yurt as this way when you go in and out the hooks will not tend to get caught on your hair or clothing. You can purchase additional Velcro from your fabric or hard where store or you can order more from us.
Dealing with wind blown dust and/or high wind conditions. Get Scotch Heavy Duty Gray All-Weather Duct Tape and or Scotch Transparent Long Lasting Duct Tape 1-800-494-3552 (regular duct tape does not hold up in the sun) both tapes are available at many hardware stores. The Heavy Duty lasts a bit longer in the sun then the Transparent but both hold up well over time. The Transparent looks better. Use for sealing up unused doors, floor to wall or shingleing when in extream dust conditions. Apply tape to dome when it is clean and dry Use only one door for entering and exiting your dome. Seal your other doors with tape. Attach sticky back Velcro on the door you use (apply when clean and dry - it takes about 24 hours for the glue on the velcro to set to full strength). Consider using just one side of your door when conditions are windy. Tuck your dome's skirt under your tarp floor and then tape your floor to your dome's skirt on the inside of your dome. Weight down your floor with all the objects you have (in high wind, wind will blow under your floor and lift it up shaking dust into the air. Seal the horizontal shingles with tape on the windward side of your dome and or any shingle that leaks dust.
On Jun 1, 2009
Wind: They do will in wind but are still a tent and are not recommended for the strongest of winds. They must be staked will to the ground. See staking in manual: http://www.shelter-systems.com/lighthouse-manual.html
Snow: They will only hold a small amount of snow. You would need to knock or melt snow off as it accumulates. Read our wind and snow warnings: http://www.shelter-systems.com/warning.html Also read about set up in cold weather: http://www.shelter-systems.com/lighthouse-manual.html
All our shelter domes are fire retarded.
The 20' has four doors, the 30' has eight. The 18' and 30' are stronger than the 20'. The reason for this is that the 18' and 20' use the same diameter poles but the poles of the 20' are longer, making it a bit less stiff. The 30' uses a larger diameter pole then the 18 and 20.
Date: May 29, 2009
Can you please tell me if the 31' dome would work if the entrance doorway was made higher by leaving out one horizontal pole? (like you show in your picture of the greenhouse dome?)
We are exploring the use of one of your domes for a temporary meditation temple/classroom space and would like an expansive feeling entrance.
Thank you kindly for your response.
You can remove the short pole above one of your doors. However this will weaken the dome some what. To create a higher door you will need to remove the fabric under this pole. If you wish to preserve the option of reattaching the dome's cover then you will want to unclip one of the clips that tensioned the pole that you removed. To do this you need to remove the other three poles attached to this clip first. Then with care, slide out the corner or the door flap and corner of the upper panel without mixing up the layering or orientation of the remaining corners. Now reapply the clip that you removed. Reinsert your domes pole less the short one above the door. With another Grip Clip join together the upper triangle corner and the lower door flap corner. Make sure the flap is under the triangle. To close your "new door," attach the upper triangle under the dome's side and lower door flap out side the lower side wall at the ground. Velcro may be of use for this but take care that the "hook" side of the velcro is on the flap and so it does not catch on hair.
I am going to be building a small geodesic greenhouse using either 3/4" or 1" EMT conduit. I've attached two 3-d renderings of the design(it's not the usual geometry).
I would like to suspend one cover from the inside of the frame using the Grip Clips and have a second cover over the outside(I'm not sure how I will do this...maybe you have some ideas). This will create an insulating air space between the two covers. This dome is intended be a tropical setting for growing mostly South American plants.
Anyway, uhmmm, my question is: Can the Grip Clip handle two pieces of overlapping/shingled 10.5 mil poly?
Also, it would be awesome if you know of a good way to attach the outside cover to the frame using the Grip Clips. I would like to avoid screws, nails, glue, welded seams, permanent fasteners, attaching wood to tubing to attach poly to wood, etc... I'd like for both of the covers to be easily adjustable.
I look forward to your answer and to any suggestions you might have.
Date: May 29, 2009
I was looking around your site some more and realized you sell greenhouse covers as well as other types. It could be that I purchase the covers from you instead of the link provided in the previous email, if the prices are comparable.
Really, as far as cover materials, cover accessories and ways of attaching the covers, everything is "up in the air" and completely re-workable. Whatever fits my needs best.
The only thing that is 99.9% certain is that the frame will be a 12ft. diameter 1V 5/8 rhombicuboctahedron made from EMT conduit sitting on a base of dirt packed cinder blocks.
I apologize if any of what I've said is redundant or unclear. I'm having a great deal of trouble forming and keeping up with what I'm saying due tension and pain. I'm just stressing out because I can't figure this out on my own. I would be grateful for whatever help you can provide.
I am not sure how our Grip Clips would work with the 10.5 material. A lot depends on stiffness and not just the mill. Our GP and Pro will grip 3 layers of our Green House covering which is about 4 mill : http://www.shelter-systems.com/accessories.html Our HD GC will grip more layers. If you send a sample I could test it for you or you could buy a sampler of our clips: http://www.shelter-systems.com/accessories.html
You could return the clips, if they are in new condition, for a refund or trade.
I would think the 10.5 material is quite stiff and hard to work with. Our covering is 6' wide and is $10 a running yard. You should be able to shape (over lap) and hang with the GP and or HD one or more layers in your frame. You can shape and support on your frame with the pro. You can shape and pull down on a covering draped over your frame.
On May 26, 2009
Subject: Re: Replace a panel with something different?
There is no problem mixing the white with greenhouse covering. The panels are approximately $65 each.
Install: Order the same panel from Shelter Systems. 1) Arrange the replacement panel over top of the damaged panel so that it is in the same orientation.2) Remove only one clip from your dome being careful not to disrupt the layering sequence of the panels on your dome. If you can not get the clip off use a pliers and brake the ring part of the clip (you will receive 4 extra Heavy Duty Grip Clips with each replacement panels). 3) Take your time to carefully slide out the corner of your damaged panel and insert your replacement panel into the same layering sequence as that of the damaged panel. 4) Now with all layers in the same order and orientation as before; gather these tightly around the male clip and slip over the female clip as described below. When many layers are involved as is the case with the corners of the windows, attaching the female clip can be difficult; practicing on scraps and making the layers warm with the sun or heat lamp (be careful not to melt the covering by getting it to hot) can help.
On May 23, 2009
Can one (1) person put up a dome/yurt ? say a 30' or what?
Yes, but it requires strength and is not recommended especially the first time. I have put up a 30' by myself (140 lb.) but it was quite a workout and I had put it up with help before. The 30' is our hardest dome to put up (you should have two strong people to help you put it up). The smaller domes are much easier. The 18' is our next toughest dome to put up. The reason these two are hardest is to make them strong against the wind. After a dome has been put up once it is quite a bit easier the next time. The reason for this is that the covering gets stretched out and the poles take a slight set.
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